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JMc BMS Copiers
9/03/2010
13:27:37
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 Subject: Which COLOR copiers should I sell?
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I've been in this industry since college in 1976 here in the metro NYC area. I like the work most of the time. I've been sitting on the sidelines too long deciding what, if any, Color copier to sell. I've serviced/sold Sharp analogs from '86 to '99 and they were terriffic till '96 & in my opinion, haven't made anything good since. Sold KMs (Copystars) since & they've excellent, but I hear negative remarks about their Color equipment. It's time to Sh*& or get off the pot. What's the consenus of what is worth handling or running awwwway from in the 5k to 10k per mo. range. Thanks in advance everyone John MC BMS Inc.
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woxner
9/03/2010
14:57:33
| RE: Which COLOR copiers should I sell?
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konicaminolta- they are excellent cq and reliable and other manufactures buy them and re brand them. low aftermarket cost per copy
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Harry
9/03/2010
18:22:22
| RE: Which COLOR copiers should I sell?
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I agree KM are good for copy quality but the supplies are expensive..Contant calls for adf misfeeds and constant noise from faulty fusers which KM said they have fixed.. Parts are also expensive.. Cost is only cheap for the box so they can get in the door...Poor support from KM. Constant firmware upgrades
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Jim intravia
9/04/2010
02:38:34
| RE: Which COLOR copiers should I sell?
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Only question now is Which KM do you mean which time?
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mincopier
9/04/2010
06:03:27
| RE: Which COLOR copiers should I sell?
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Sorry about the long post, but I think some clarification needs to be mentioned.
We sell KonicaMinolta and the Savin/Ricoh line of products. The Ricoh is a cheaper machine and also cheaper to maintain. But you also get what you pay for. Not saying it is a bad product. Between the two as a tech I prefer the KonicaMinolta. More training.
A lot will have to do with what type of customer you have. If they are going to run non-typical paper we sell them the KonicaMinolta machine. It seem to handle thicker and glossy paper better. If they have no use for nonstandard paper we sell them the Savin product.
As for cost of maintenance on the Savin side the drum and developer in general are two different parts that can be replace separately. On the Konicaminolta side they are generally one unit that have to be replaced at the same time. The Konicaminolta fuser is a heavier product. Heavy duty parts compared to the Savin.
As for noise, I have hear both products give noise. The fuser on the C451 and C452 series is fixed. The problem is a gear pack above the fuser and a fuser rotation detect assy on the machine. This sits to the right of the electromagnet as you face the right side of the machine. Lube them both with a high temp grease that can take 260 degrees Celsius. Most I have seen fail at about 240 degrees. The machine typically runs at 250 degrees so it becomes a temporary fix since the grease is liquefying at the normal operating temperature.
Lately I have had to do more firmware upgrades on the Savin line to get them to scan to W7 then I have had to do on the Konicaminolta side. Savin comes out with regular updates that should also be applied on a regular basis.
Savin/Ricoh has had a problem with the touch panel loosing calibration and then not working at all. Seems they had bad glue at the manufacture during assy. Heating and cooling caused the screen to not work. They have a free replacement for these but initially they were hard to get since nearly every machine was suffering from this.
All the manufactures have there problems. It just comes down to what can you get the best support on. What product can you get parts for easily on the aftermarket if you are not an authorized dealer. Granted these boards have a lot of great information and techs but if you are not familiar with the product and the customer needs fixed now these boards are about useless. Sometimes, depending on who is online, you could have an answer in a few minutes or several hours.
Again myself I prefer the KonicaMinolta line over the Savin/Ricoh line but that is because I have more training on the KonicaMinolta line of machines. The Savin/Ricoh is a great product and as long as sales sells the right machine to the customer both perform very well.
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JMc BMS
9/04/2010
09:22:24
|  RE: Which COLOR copiers should I sell?
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As an independant dealer, I've always made sure to have at least 3 suppliers before taking on a line of equipment. I'll look further into the Konica-Minolta. Thanks to all that replied.
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Clickman
9/04/2010
11:11:33
| RE: Which COLOR copiers should I sell?
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I find most customers miss-use and dislike the color machines after they have them.
They do not make color machines for POOR people who cost of operation is a factor.
color machines are designed for 90% color 10% B&W regardless of what OEM marketing says
Color machines cost more per page than OEMS claim
Customer who buy a color machine must STILL have good B&W machines too.
Customers will complain every time they buy toner because cost is high -- so they will buy Remans on line and then have problems and blaming the machine not their stupid choice.
most OEMS think color machine 3 years life.
Your question depends on size and price range and volume. Low end I sell Samsung and for the customer who understand the limits and proper use and COST. Like them.
I get calls all the time people mad at the other dealer who sold them a color machine under the wrong premises..
In the end the simple work (B&W) is the profitable the color has it's profit but problems too.
Just because the customer ask for color does not mean they really need color. Most think the color machine is same cost and reliable as the B&W machines just it does color.
They fail to understand a color machine is 4 machines in one and thus accumulative cost that is more then just the toner, which most decide after buying the color machine is too costly to operate.
Right tool for the job..
I love my color machine, but I know the real cost factors and make my customers understand before they buy. and buy the way I need a full set of toner $600.00 and I understand that.
better the buy from the other guy and be mad at him if they are not listening
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Brian
9/05/2010
09:50:13
| RE: Which COLOR copiers should I sell?
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I do not know a whole lot about other brands but the newest line MX2600/MX3100 etc... color copiers from sharp give much better color quality then most the competitors from the side by side comparisons I have seen. However one draw back to the Sharps is the bigger color machines are awesome as far as service goes they do not require much to mantain nor is call volume high on them. It is the smaller sharp line MXC311 MXC401 though that in my opinion give awesome copy quality for almost no cost but the service calls seem to be high on them and nothing is rebuildable on them fuser units drum units etc....
therefore cost per copy is a bit higher.
As what a previous person said you get what you pay for. The older line of sharps color machine I would stay away from but the newer line isnt bad. Sharps tech support team kind of sucks for experienced techs. Its good for mid level to begineer techs but you quickly outgrow their help capabilities. Id say Sharp tech support is mediocre at best.
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Dacopyman
9/06/2010
07:07:03
| RE: Which COLOR copiers should I sell?
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We carry Konica Minolta main line with Kyocera as a 2nd. We like K/M a lot better & Kyocera's new "Task-alpha" Color machine I have heard nothing but bad about it. K/M seems to be almost switching everyting to color & making it affordable. I can't keep track of all the model numbers anymore but know we work on everything from I believe a C260 (26 cmp) to C6500 with a new 80 cpm machine out now as well. I'm finding 90%+ are being installed "connected" scanning & replacing hp printers ect. as cost per copy is less. The new machines now have seperate drum / Dev. units making it more affordable. So far so good. I'm seeing a lot of happy customers thrilled that they now have color printing as well as copying at less cost in many cases than their old b/w copier.
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gar
9/07/2010
10:47:06
| RE: Which COLOR copiers should I sell?
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So far, our Kyocera-MITA color copiers have ran with only 1 problem, and that was the computer program. Our TaskAlpha's are only 6 & 9 months old but all Ok for now. Our older MITA's are also doing fine.
The expense of color is a BIG deal as I have replaced a Samsung CLX 3160 with a B/W after 2 1/2 years. The Samsung paid for itself over the HP ink Jet they had but with the down turn they needed to print/copy cheeper.
K/Mita color desktop printers seem to get tired after about 5 years,but well behaved during that time frame. With a 200K P/M cycle most of our Clients never get to the P/M before they up-grade. 20-30K prints per year so all they use is toner and the printers are at 150K when they up-grade, so no big expense for drum,ETC.
Volume and run cost the 2 Big questions.
Gar
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